You’re Nine Times More Likely to be Killed by a Police Officer than a Terrorist

Putting Risk In Context

The U.S. Department of State reports that only 17 U.S. citizens were killed worldwide as a result of terrorism in 2011.* That figure includes deaths in Afghanistan, Iraq and all other theaters of war.

In contrast, the American agency which tracks health-related issues – the U.S. Centers for Disease Control – rounds up the most prevalent causes of death in the United States:

Comparing the CDC numbers to terrorism deaths means:

– You are 35,079 times more likely to die from heart disease than from a terrorist attack

– You are 33,842 times more likely to die from cancer than from a terrorist attack

(Keep in mind when reading this entire piece that we are consistently and substantially understating the risk of other causes of death as compared to terrorism, because we are comparing deaths from various causes within the United States against deaths from terrorism worldwide.)

Wikipedia notes that obesity is a a contributing factor in 100,000–400,000 deaths in the United States per year. That makes obesity 5,882 to 23,528 times more likely to kill you than a terrorist.

The annual number of deaths in the U.S. due to avoidable medical errors is as high as 100,000. Indeed, one of the world’s leading medical journals – Lancet – reported in 2011:

A November, 2010, document from the Office of the Inspector General of the Department of Health and Human Services reported that, when in hospital, one in seven beneficiaries of Medicare (the government-sponsored health-care programme for those aged 65 years and older) have complications from medical errors, which contribute to about 180 000 deaths of patients per year.

That’s just Medicare beneficiaries, not the entire American public. Scientific American noted in 2009:

Preventable medical mistakes and infections are responsible for about 200,000 deaths in the U.S. each year, according to an investigation by the Hearst media corporation.

And a new study in the current issue of the Journal of Patient Safety says the numbers may be up to 440,000 each year.

But let’s use the lower – 100,000 – figure. That still means that you are 5,882 times more likely to die from medical error than terrorism.

The CDC says that some 80,000 deaths each year are attributable to excessive alcohol use. So you’re 4,706 times more likely to drink yourself to death than die from terrorism.

Wikipedia notes that there were 32,367 automobile accidents in 2011, which means that you are 1,904 times more likely to die from a car accident than from a terrorist attack. As CNN reporter Fareed Zakaria wrote last year:

“Since 9/11, foreign-inspired terrorism has claimed about two dozen lives in the United States. (Meanwhile, more than 100,000 have been killed in gun homicides and more than 400,000 in motor-vehicle accidents.) “

President Obama agreed.

According to a 2011 CDC report, poisoning from prescription drugs is even more likely to kill you than a car crash. Indeed, the CDC stated in 2011 that – in the majority of states – your prescription meds are more likely to kill you than any other source of injury. So your meds are thousands of times more likely to kill you than Al Qaeda.

The financial crisis has also caused quite a few early deaths. The Guardian reported in 2008:

High-income countries such as the UK and US could see a 6.4% surge in deaths from heart disease, while low-income countries could experience a 26% rise in mortality rates.

Since there were 596,339 deaths from heart disease in the U.S. in 2011 (see CDC table above), that means that there are approximately 38, 165 additional deaths a year from the financial crisis … and Americans are 2,245 times more likely to die from a financial crisis that a terrorist attack.

Financial crises cause deaths in other ways, as well. For example, the poverty rate has skyrocketed in the U.S. since the 2008 crash. For example, the poverty rate in 2010 was the highest in 17 years, and more Americans numerically were in poverty as of 2011 than for more than 50 years. Poverty causes increased deaths from hunger, inability to pay for heat and shelter, and other causes. (And – as mentioned below – suicides have skyrocketed recently; many connect the increase in suicides to the downturn in the economy.)

The number of deaths by suicide has also surpassed car crashes. Around 35,000 Americans kill themselves each year (and more American soldiers die by suicide than combat; the number of veterans committing suicide is astronomical and under-reported). So you’re 2,059 times more likely to kill yourself than die at the hand of a terrorist.

The CDC notes that there were 7,638 deaths from HIV and 45 from syphilis, so you’re 452 times more likely to die from risky sexual behavior than terrorism. (That doesn’t include death by autoerotic asphyxiation … discussed below.)

The National Safety Council reports that more than 6,000 Americans die a year from falls … most of them involve people falling off their roof or ladder trying to clean their gutters, put up Christmas lights and the like. That means that you’re 353 times more likely to fall to your death doing something idiotic than die in a terrorist attack.

The same number – 6,000 – die annually from texting while driving. So you’re 353 times more likely to meet your maker while lol’ing than by terrorism.

The agency in charge of workplace safety – the U.S. Occupational Safety and Health Administration – reports that 4,609 workers were killed on the job in 2011 within the U.S. homeland. In other words, you are 271 times more likely to die from a workplace accident than terrorism.

The CDC notes that 3,177 people died of “nutritional deficiencies” in 2011, which means you are 187 times more likely to starve to death in American than be killed by terrorism.

Approximately 1,000 Americans die each year from autoerotic asphyxiation. So you’re 59 times more likely to kill yourself doing weird, kinky things than at the hands of a terrorist.

Some 450 Americans die each year when they fall out of bed, 26 times more than are killed by terrorists.

Scientific American notes:

You might have toxoplasmosis, an infection caused by the microscopic parasite Toxoplasma gondii, which the CDC estimates has infected about 22.5 percent of Americans older than 12 years old

Toxoplasmosis is a brain-parasite. The CDC reports that more than 375 Americans die annually due to toxoplasmosis. In addition, 3 Americans died in 2011 after being exposed to a brain-eating amoeba. So you’re about 22 times more likely to die from a brain-eating zombie parasite than a terrorist.

There were at least 155 Americans killed by police officers in the United States in 2011. That means that you were more than 9 times more likely to be killed by a law enforcement officer than by a terrorist. ()

Around 34 Americans a year are killed by dog bites … around twice as many as by terrorists.

The 2011 Report on Terrorism from the National Counter Terrorism Center notes that Americans are just as likely to be “crushed to death by their televisions or furniture each year” as they are to be killed by terrorists.

Statistics from the Centers for Disease Control show that Americans are 110 times more likely to die from contaminated food than terrorism. And see this.

The Jewish Daily Forward noted in May that – even including the people killed in the Boston bombing – you are more likely to be killed by a toddler than a terrorist. And see these statistics from CNN.

Reason notes:

[The risk of being killed by terrorism] compares annual risk of dying in a car accident of 1 in 19,000; drowning in a bathtub at 1 in 800,000; dying in a building fire at 1 in 99,000; or being struck by lightning at 1 in 5,500,000. In other words, in the last five years you were four times more likely to be struck by lightning than killed by a terrorist.

The National Consortium for the Study of Terrorism and Responses to Terrorism (START) has just published, Background Report: 9/11, Ten Years Later [PDF]. The report notes, excluding the 9/11 atrocities, that fewer than 500 people died in the U.S. from terrorist attacks between 1970 and 2010.

Scientific American reported in 2011:

John Mueller, a political scientist at Ohio State University, and Mark Stewart, a civil engineer and authority on risk assessment at University of Newcastle in Australia … contended, “a great deal of money appears to have been misspent and would have been far more productive—saved far more lives—if it had been expended in other ways.”

chart comparing annual fatality risksMueller and Stewart noted that, in general, government regulators around the world view fatality risks—say, from nuclear power, industrial toxins or commercial aviation—above one person per million per year as “acceptable.” Between 1970 and 2007 Mueller and Stewart asserted in a separate paper published last year in Foreign Affairs that a total of 3,292 Americans (not counting those in war zones) were killed by terrorists resulting in an annual risk of one in 3.5 million. Americans were more likely to die in an accident involving a bathtub (one in 950,000), a home appliance (one in 1.5 million), a deer (one in two million) or on a commercial airliner (one in 2.9 million).

The global mortality rate of death by terrorism is even lower. Worldwide, terrorism killed 13,971 people between 1975 and 2003, an annual rate of one in 12.5 million. Since 9/11 acts of terrorism carried out by Muslim militants outside of war zones have killed about 300 people per year worldwide. This tally includes attacks not only by al Qaeda but also by “imitators, enthusiasts, look-alikes and wannabes,” according to Mueller and Stewart.

Defenders of U.S. counterterrorism efforts might argue that they have kept casualties low by thwarting attacks. But investigations by the FBI and other law enforcement agencies suggest that 9/11 may have been an outlier—an aberration—rather than a harbinger of future attacks. Muslim terrorists are for the most part “short on know-how, prone to make mistakes, poor at planning” and small in number, Mueller and Stewart stated. Although still potentially dangerous, terrorists hardly represent an “existential” threat on a par with those posed by Nazi Germany or the Soviet Union.

In fact, Mueller and Stewart suggested in Homeland Security Affairs, U.S. counterterrorism procedures may indirectly imperil more lives than they preserve: “Increased delays and added costs at U.S. airports due to new security procedures provide incentive for many short-haul passengers to drive to their destination rather than flying, and, since driving is far riskier than air travel, the extra automobile traffic generated has been estimated to result in 500 or more extra road fatalities per year.”

The funds that the U.S. spends on counterterrorism should perhaps be diverted to other more significant perils, such as industrial accidents (one in 53,000), violent crime (one in 22,000), automobile accidents (one in 8,000) and cancer (one in 540). “Overall,” Mueller and Stewart wrote, “vastly more lives could have been saved if counterterrorism funds had instead been spent on combating hazards that present unacceptable risks.” In an e-mail to me, Mueller elaborated:

“The key question, never asked of course, is what would the likelihood be if the added security measures had not been put in place? And, if the chances without the security measures might have been, say, one in 2.5 million per year, were the trillions of dollars in investment (including overseas policing which may have played a major role) worth that gain in security—to move from being unbelievably safe to being unbelievably unbelievably safe? Given that al Qaeda and al Qaeda types have managed to kill some 200 to 400 people throughout the entire world each year outside of war zones since 9/11—including in areas that are far less secure than the U.S.—there is no reason to anticipate that the measures have deterred, foiled or protected against massive casualties in the United States. If the domestic (we leave out overseas) enhanced security measures put into place after 9/11 have saved 100 lives per year in the United States, they would have done so at a cost of $1 billion per saved life. That same money, if invested in a measure that saves lives at a cost of $1 million each—like passive restraints for buses and trucks—would have saved 1,000 times more lives.”

Mueller and Stewart’s analysis is conservative, because it excludes the most lethal and expensive U.S. responses to 9/11. Al Qaeda’s attacks also provoked the U.S. into invading and occupying two countries, at an estimated cost of several trillion dollars. The wars in Afghanistan and Iraq have resulted in the deaths of more than 6,000 Americans so far—more than twice as many as were killed on September 11, 2001—as well as tens of thousands of Iraqis and Afghans.

***

In 2007 New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg said that people are more likely to be killed by lightning than terrorism. “You can’t sit there and worry about everything,” Bloomberg exclaimed. “Get a life.”

Indeed, the Senior Research Scientist for the Space Science Institute (Alan W. Harris) estimates that the odds of being killed by a terrorist attack is about the same as being hit by an asteroid (and see this).

Terrorism pushes our emotional buttons. And politicians and the media tend to blow the risk of terrorism out of proportion. But as the figures above show, terrorism is a very unlikely cause of death.

Indeed, our spending on anti-terrorism measures is way out of whack … especially because most of the money has been wasted. And see this article, and this 3-minute video by professor Mueller:

Indeed, mission creep in the name of countering terrorism actually makes us more vulnerable to terrorist attacks.

And corrupt government policy is arguably more dangerous than terrorism.

* Note: The most recent official report – published in 2012 – shows that even fewer Americans were killed by terrorists than in the previous year.

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  • ClubToTheHead

    The war on terrorism was never anything more than a racket to protect and enrich the 1%.

    The 99% have always paid the price in lives and treasure to ensure fluffy pillows under the asses of the wealthy.

  • ClubToTheHead

    The war on terrorism was never anything more than a racket to protect and enrich the 1%.

    The 99% have always paid the price in lives and treasure to ensure fluffy pillows under the asses of the wealthy.

    • Albury Smith

      Call me crazy, but I feel somewhat enriched by the prospect of boarding an airliner without a suicide terrorist flying along with me for part of the trip, and I’m not in the 1%. I’d rather not be hit by an airliner or its flying debris either. It’s a price in lives and treasure I don’t want to pay.

      • Joe Hill

        seriously? you sit around and worry about this? But then again, conservative mindset=FEAR!!!!!

        • Albury Smith

          When did I say that I sit around and worry about anything, and what makes you think I’m conservative, pray tell?

          • Gary Wolfenbarger

            MY fear is of the TRUE 9/11 conspirators, elements of our own govt, and NWO profiteers. And a growing control mechanism known as the DHS.
            Few recall the announcement made by D. Rumsfeld on 9/10/2001.
            That the Pentagon was unable to account for $2.3trillion in transactions (the current figure is $7.8trillion, 1999 to 2013). Further, the missile that hit the Pentagon struck an area occupied by accountants working on the issue. The area was under construction, and sparsely occupied. After all, how could a highjacked airliner penetrate the most secure airspace in the world?
            The “war on terror”, is an all out assault on our freedoms, and rights.
            How can humiliating us prior to boarding our flight protect us, while tens of thousands pour in, unabated, and unscreened, across our southern boarder?

          • Albury Smith

            Most of the TRUE 9/11 conspirators are dead or in Gitmo, but Dr. Ayman al-Zawahiri is still hiding and occasionally taunting the US. The ~$2.3 trillion referenced by Rumsfeld was from many decades of Pentagon waste, contractor fraud, lousy bookkeeping practices, and the other usual bureaucratic follies, not some bizarre declaration of a motive to fake some al Qaeda suicide attacks on the evil US.
            The “missile” that hit the Pentagon was AA 77, and Hanjour didn’t much care where on the exterior he crashed it.
            https://sites.google.com/site/wtc7lies/911pentagonflight77evidencesummary
            https://sites.google.com/site/wtc7lies/pentagonattackpage2
            If your freedoms and rights are suffering, please emigrate. Pakistan and Yemen are particularly warm and hospitable, but there’s also sunny Afghanistan, Egypt, Iraq, Iran…

          • Gary Wolfenbarger

            Well you seem(ed) intelligent. I don’t need to emigrate, elected officials need to follow the Constitution, aka, the law of the land.

            So you believe the 9/11 Omission Report was accurate? That AA 77 fit into a 16′ round hole? That the Pentagon FORGOT the Pentagon has air defenses? That jet fuel can melt steel? That titanium engines and black boxes can vaporize, while paper passports survive? That WTC 7 collapsed due to office fires?

            Say hello to the tooth fairy, and Easter Bunny for me.

            BTW, 1999 to 2013, $7.8T the Pentagon can’t account for.

          • Albury Smith

            You didn’t (and don’t) seem intelligent at all. You “FORGOT” that Reagan National Airport is ~1 mile away from the Pentagon and was on 9/11/01 too, with a runway pointing right at its NE corner, and scores of US airliners fly over those alleged “air defenses” daily. Both AA 77’s FDR and CVR were recovered inside the Pentagon along with both engines and enough human remains to identify all on board except one small infant. The FDR had recoverable data showing its exact flight path, speed, etc. Tell American Airlines that their 757 wasn’t “really” crashed there — they’ve paid undisclosed millions to victims inside the Pentagon who weren’t covered by the 9/11 VCF.
            The two of your al Qaeda heroes’ passports that survived the crashes and fires were among MANY combustibles that did, and had no evidentiary value that wasn’t available from many other sources. The melting of steel is not part of any NIST collapse hypothesis, so I’d say you’re seriously fos.

          • Gary Wolfenbarger

            Following up on your comments, one of the 9/11 videos I was most impressed by, showed a fighter hitting a concrete wall at 500 mph. The fighter basically vaporized on impact, barely penetrating the wall. But, AA-77, a commercial airliner, plastic nose and thin aluminum body, penetrated, how many of the steel reinforced, concrete Pentagon walls? With all the CCTV at the Pentagon, that ONE parking gate camera alone, caught the action, is strange. And I/m sure the govt wouldn’t lie about how many plane parts, or DNA evidence was recovered on 9/11.

            BTW, congrats on having over 6700 comments, nearly triple that of high commentators, and 100 times the number of most concerned citizens .

          • Albury Smith

            Thanks; I don’t drink 9/11 “truth movement” Kool-Aid so I get a lot more replies than most other commenters do. NO Pentagon camera really caught the action — they aren’t fast enough at ~1 frame/sec to record video of an object traveling ~800’/sec. No-planers are the truly bottom of the heap, but please enlighten all of these people to what they didn’t see inside the Pentagon after your al Qaeda heroes crashed AA 77 into it:

            Alexandria VA Fire & Rescue, American Airlines, American Red Cross, Arlington County Emergency Medical Services, Arlington County Fire Department, Arlington County Sheriff’s Department, Arlington VA Police Department, Armed Forces Institute of Pathology, Bureau of Alcohol Tobacco and Firearms, DiLorenzo TRICARE Health Clinic staff, DeWitt Army Community Hospital staff, District of Columbia Fire & Rescue, DOD Honor Guard, Environmental Protection Agency Hazmat Teams, Fairfax County Fire & Rescue, FBI Evidence Recovery Teams, FBI Hazmat Teams, Federal Aviation Administration, Federal Disaster Medical Assistance Teams, FEMA 68-Person Urban Search and Rescue Teams Maryland Task Force 1, New Mexico Task Force 1, Tennessee Task Force 1, Virginia Task Force 1, Virginia Task Force 2, FEMA Emergency Response Team, Fort Myer Fire Department, Four U.S. Army Chaplains, Metropolitan Airport Authority Fire Unit, Military District of Washington Engineers Search & Rescue Team, Montgomery County Fire & Rescue, U.S. National Guard units, National Naval Medical Center CCRF, National Transportation Safety Board, Pentagon Defense Protective Service, Pentagon Helicopter Crash Response Team, Pentagon Medical Staff, Rader Army Health Clinic Staff, SACE Structural Safety Engineers and Debris Planning and Response Teams, Salvation Army Disaster Services, U.S. Army Corps of Engineers, US Army Reserves of Virginia Beach Fairfax County and Montgomery County, Virginia Beach Fire Department, Virginia Department of Emergency Management, Virginia State Police
            More info here:
            https://sites.google.com/site/wtc7lies/911pentagonflight77evidencesummary
            and:
            https://sites.google.com/site/wtc7lies/pentagonattackpage2

          • Albury Smith

            I believe you’ve never read the 9/11 Commission Report.

          • Gary Wolfenbarger

            OOPS! I apologize, you don’t believe in myths at all.
            You’re not ignorant, you’re a troll.
            YO EVERYBODY! TROLL ALERT!

          • Albury Smith

            Typical 9/11 truther nut…

          • 2032 Asteroid Coming

            Haha typical sheep who believes in Television.. Tell a vision programming you were easily fooled, me being a freemason who builds shit for a living guarantees it was a detonation. Why was World Trader Center 7 Fall hmm?? I win.. gameover

          • Albury Smith

            OK; you’re a sandwich. Now run along and ask Box Boy* and his “more than 2100 [9/11 crackpots]” to show you on video with audio how explosives or incendiaries secretly cut the 4.91″ flanges, 3.07″ webs, and 215 sq in cross sections of W14 X 730 columns like the 11 of 24 in WTC 7’s core, and the 4 corner columns in each tower’s core:
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0c2o8k4n9CY
            http://www.ochshorndesign.com/cornell/writings/milstein-critique/images/8-fig04.png
            If they ever HAD TO do it, this “debate” would be OVER.
            *Box Boy’s ONLY 9/11 “research”:
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFVi4qbN2jM
            Where’s my sandwich?

          • shifafa

            I’ve been a Feminist since 1949, my spouse, our daughterinlaw is a Feminist, all our close friends are feminists and they will all support me in calling you out! You, twit, are much too stupid to be a woman. I certainly hope you don’t pass your damaged genetic rot along to another generation. Abortion IS still legal in most of our ravaged Nation. Grab a clue, bagger!

          • Albury Smith

            Wtf does any of this have to do with my comment?

          • roccolore

            You are the twit who defends copkillers and Kermit Gosnell.

          • Chas Burns

            no sir you are the type that needs to emigrate to china or Vietnam.

            where people freely give up there freedoms. we emigrated to this country to get away from government abuses. then we fought a war to win that freedom. idiots like yourself are giving or freedom away to a new government hierarchy not of the people or for the people.and to be quit frank about it you are a supporter of terrorists in this country which are fractions in this government taking our freedoms . and by god when enough of us realize it we will have another war to gain or freedoms back. I only hope we learned the lesson this time and dont allow ignorant and naive individuals like you to live in our free country.

          • shifafa

            The tripe you post prooves it, baggs!

          • Albury Smith

            What tripe?

          • Mike Amerine

            Don’t sweat it, Albury. The population of Manhattan is over 1.5 million people. There are literally hundreds of personal video cameras and tens-of-thousands of eyewitnesses that saw the planes in New York City and people still claim they weren’t there. I worked in the Navy Annex (before they demolished it a couple of years ago). It was right beside where the airliner flew before it hit the Pentagon. There were hundreds of people that felt the building shake and heard the plane fly by before the explosion. There were street lamps snapped off by the wings as the plane flew low across the streets. Eyewitnesses in cars, etc…. In fact, about 3 or so years ago when the earthquake happened in D.C., many of the people in the office freaked out and thought it was another airliner.

            You cannot fix some folks with facts. It would help, however, if the full truth of the event and the surrounding intel were not so shady. There are a lot of unanswered questions and a lot of cover-ups. But, there were planes at all three sites. That is not in dispute by anyone worth listening to.

          • roccolore

            OccuFascists like you were happy when Wenjian Liu and Raphael Ramos were killed.

      • Broon

        didn’t you read the article? the chance of there being a terrorist on your plane is almost zero. You may as well worry about an asteroid knocking the plane out of the sky. But you don’t worry about that, do you?

        • Albury Smith

          What were the terrorism odds on AA11, UA 175, AA 77, and UA 93 on 9/1/01? The US doesn’t ignore the other threats in the article, so why would it want another ~3000 or more innocent people murdered in terrorist attacks? According to the specious nonsense in the article, more terrorists and fewer law enforcement people would make Americans safer.

          • 2032 Asteroid Coming

            Yea go crawl in a corner 911 was a inside Job.. Sorry to break the news but billions of dollars were made by bankers who also caused the 2008 stock crash manipulating markets.. All wars are banker wars nothing else

          • Albury Smith

            I’ve never heard these people called bankers before:
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GW8_Zbsirdw
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWVC4JBjtEE
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6obQ5naNn0
            From OBL’s 1998 (second) fatwa: “The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies-civilians and military-is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it, in order to liberate the al-Aqsa Mosque and the holy mosque [Mecca] from their grip, and in order for their armies to move out of all the lands of Islam, defeated and unable to threaten any Muslim. This is in accordance with the words of Almighty God, ‘and fight the pagans all together as they fight you all together,’ and ‘fight them until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in God [blah, blah, blah…]'”
            Are Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi and his ISIL savages bankers too?

          • Dave

            While I do not agree with the totality of your post, I’m going to give you a thumbs up for the research/documentation.

          • Albury Smith

            The 9/11 al Qaeda Planes Operation SUICIDE attack on the evil US infidel, i.e. their THIRD suicide attack on the US in ~37 months, was not a whodunit; they WANTED the world to know they did it. I’d recommend reading “Holy War, Inc” and “Manhunt” by Peter L. Bergen, and Pulitzer Prize-winning “The Looming Tower” by Lawrence Wright.

          • Dave

            Thank you. I’ll check those books out..

          • Albury Smith

            “Manhunt” is post-9/11 to May 2, 2011 Abbottabad SEAL raid that finally offed the sick bastard, and “Holy War, Inc.” was published in 2001 right after the 9/11 attacks. I think Bergen’s the foremost Western authority on OBL and al Qaeda; he and CNN’s Peter Arnett interviewed him face-to-face in Afghanistan in 1997 and Bergen’s traveled extensively in Afghanistan, Pakistan, Yemen, etc. getting to know some of these prominent Islamists personally. Lawrence Wright is equally scholarly, and “The Looming Tower” traces the roots of Islamic terrorism back to the end of WWII. Egypt’s Sayyid Qutb was one of the pioneers of it, and went to college in the US.

          • Cut the fraud already government troll!

            Go get an engineering degree and then come talk to me; a structural engineer that can prove through physics that all 3 WTC structures were destroyed by controlled demolitions.

            Go kiss Rothschilds and Rockefeller asses some more you retard.

            David M. Pacheco
            Structural/Geotechnical/Civil Engineer

          • Albury Smith

            You’ve had way too much Kool-Aid, dude. If you knew anything at all about physics you wouldn’t be a 9/11 truther nut, but please feel free to ask Box Boy* and his “more than 2100 [9/11 crackpots]” to show you on video with audio how explosives or incendiaries secretly cut the 4.91″ flanges, 3.07″ webs, and 215 sq in cross-sectional areas of W14 X 730 columns like the 11 of 24 in WTC 7’s core, and the 4 corner columns in each tower’s core:
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0c2o8k4n9CY
            http://www.ochshorndesign.com/cornell/writings/milstein-critique/images/8-fig04.png
            If they ever HAD TO do it, this “debate” would be OVER.
            *Box Boy’s ONLY 9/11 “research”:
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFVi4qbN2jM

          • Albury Smith

            The comment you’re replying to has nothing to do with your unscientific and paranoid fantasies about secret C/Ds in NYC, dude.

          • Look me up on ae911truth.org.

            Thanks for being a sell out coward!

          • Albury Smith

            I looked you up on ae911″truth,” and see that you’re nothing more than a parrot for Box Boy, who hasn’t peddled his BS in more than a year:
            http://www.ae911truth.org/en/events.html
            Here are some of the MANY (as in ALL) relevant professional organizations and publications that totally ignore your chief crackpot.
            His own(?) AIA wants nothing to do with him or his 9/11 “truth” wackos:
            http://www.architectmagazine.com/architecture/architects-shy-from-truther-conspiracy-theory.aspx
            The RIBA doesn’t either:
            http://www.bdonline.co.uk/11-talk/5020382.article
            This ~$314.5 million lawsuit over WTC 7’s collapse doesn’t even mention him:
            http://www.leagle.com/decision/In%20FCO%2020131204097
            The ASCE, NCSEA, SEI, SEAoNY, Journal of Engineering Mechanics,
            structuremag.org, ENR, etc. want nothing to do with him either, nor does the Uniformed Firefighters Association IAFF Local 94, or the Ironworker Locals 40 & 361.

            Am I supposed to believe that you’re any brighter than Box Boy?

          • I have personally contacted every engineering board in the United States. Not one engineer with any of these boards has even tried to disprove me.

            You think your special because you can show a couple of pictures of steel beams and put a couple of dimensions in your response? Like I said GET AN ENGINEERING degree and then come talk to me.

            In the mean time, enjoy sucking up to your con artist Rothschilds masters over at the Federal Reserve you sycophant joke. I feel sorry for your mother – your a discrace to humanity.

          • Albury Smith

            Not one real engineer or architect wants anything to do with you LooneyTunes, as I just illustrated amply. If you had an engineering degree, you’d know that W14 X 730s don’t make very good “beams,” but it’s obvious that you don’t even know the difference between beams and columns.

          • Get a life retard. Please change your profile picture as well. You look like a pathetic joke.

            Hope your government salary is worth selling out your family and your nation.

          • Albury Smith

            I’m not the topic here. Put up or shut up:
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0c2o8k4n9CY
            http://www.ochshorndesign.com/cornell/writings/milstein-critique/images/8-fig04.png

            Let’s see your secret C/D “theory” in action on some 4.91″ flanges and a 3.07″ web, or is Scientific Method just for everyone else?

          • By the way beams and columns are used interchangeably in engineering. All you have to to is change the orientation. Of course you are too stupid to realize that.

          • Albury Smith

            How far do W14 X 730 “beams” span, jackass? Stick to supersizing Happy Meals™ and Big Macs™ for your McDonald’s customers and leave forensic structural engineering to competent and experienced SEs

          • Like you? Show some credentials! Check my record I’m VERIFIED!

          • Albury Smith

            Poor Jessie Evans was VERIFIED too, and look what happened to him:
            http://www.duffelblog.com/2013/09/911-truther-killed/
            Only 27 years old, just asking questions, and…….KABOOM!!!!
            Please be extra careful around hi-rise buildings.
            How terribly tragic… :-((

          • Bring it on punk! You think you can take me? Vamonos

          • Albury Smith

            I care about you. PLEASE be careful around hi-rise buildings. Poor Jessie:
            http://www.duffelblog.com/2013/09/911-truther-killed/

          • It’s bed time child!

          • Your real cute! You freckle faced cartoon!

          • Albury Smith

            “Your” [sic] real cute too, dickhead. It’s time to renew your vow:
            http://www.theonion.com/articles/911-truther-vows-not-to-rest-until-everyone-knows,35319/

          • It’s hard to be good, but its good to be hard!

          • I’m curious to see if your government algorithm can respond to the real! Let em know how ya fell, 24 seven 365 we trill!

          • Who’s ya daddy?

          • Albury Smith

            Here’s yours:
            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFVi4qbN2jM
            Now go Supersize™ some Happy Meals™ and Big Macs™ or something, jackass.

          • Pay our dues to your corporate masters!

          • Albury Smith

            See if these people need an office boy:
            http://www.nist.gov/el/disasterstudies/wtc/team_members.cfm

          • Don’t worry…..they will GIVE YOU the crumbs from THEIR table.

          • shifafa

            BINGO!!

          • Albury Smith

            I’ve never heard these people called bankers before:
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GW8_Zbsirdw
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWVC4JBjtEE
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-6obQ5naNn0
            From OBL’s 1998 (second) fatwa: “The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies-civilians and military-is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it, in order to liberate the al-Aqsa Mosque and the holy mosque [Mecca] from their grip, and in order for their armies to move out of all the lands of Islam, defeated and unable to threaten any Muslim. This is in accordance with the words of Almighty God, ‘and fight the pagans all together as they fight you all together,’ and ‘fight them until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in God [blah, blah, blah…]'”
            Are Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi and his ISIL savages bankers too?

          • shifafa

            BINGO!

          • roccolore

            Fascist Democrats like you hate America.

          • Dave

            The odds on those flights were also, almost zero… But after Millions upon Millions of flights, stuff happens.. Again, you have about the same odds of being harmed by an asteroid while flying.. Read the article!

          • Albury Smith

            Stuff happened to 246 innocent people aboard those 4 flights on 9/11/2001, and their after-the-fact odds are moot. If there are sensible ways to prevent an asteroid from killing us, the sensible among us will use them.

          • Dave

            Very good point Albury, I agree. If there were sensible ways to prevent an steroid from killing us, by all means – let’s employ them. But unfortunately, there is not. Just like with random acts of Terrorism. There is
            absolutely no way we can prevent Terrorism and maintain our standard
            of American living which is based on Liberties and Freedom. The alternative is
            living in a prison..

            Like it or not, we live in a world where statistics direct many
            of our priorities. We won’t spend Trillions of dollars
            attempting to prevent Asteroid Collisions with aircraft. We just
            won’t, because it does not pose that great of a risk. The same is
            true with Terrorism, although our country has suffered
            from fear-mongering and knee-jerk reactions after 9/11 where we
            think we can control other people’s senseless acts.. But we cannot..
            And we should not waste our valuable, short time here on this planet worrying about it..

            Let me pose this question to you: Would
            you rather live in a perfectly secure, sanitary world where there
            are no risks, and we give up all of our Liberties and Tax Dollars
            to the Government in the name of keeping us safe? or would you
            rather be free, coming and going in our Free Society as you
            please, with no unnecessary intrusions into your privacy, or
            interruptions in your life?

          • Albury Smith

            I just visited the National 9/11 Memorial & Museum yesterday. Do the same and then ask that question.

          • John

            If every American had your train of thought, we’d be living in a Nazi Germany type state already. We’re closer than ever to a full blown police state because people like you are willing to give up your liberty for so called “security” that the government says you need. It’s scary that people like you exist and are so willing to enslave yourself instead of using common sense to think for yourselfyourself.

          • Albury Smith

            Most sane Americans do have my train of thought, and understand why securty had to be heightened after we saw what 19 suicide hijackers could do to us. 9/11 Museum entry requires ~3 minutes of emptying all pockets, putting all belongings into little plastic bins, and enduring the horrors of a scanning booth for 3 seconds or so, but discourages suicide vests and other contraband that would slaughter even more people of all ethnicities worldwide for “Allah.” ~2,977 innocent people were murdered on 9/11/01, and many others have died from related health issues since then, so they avoided all of this enslavement you’re lamenting. I guess we’re just not as courageous and sensible as you, huh?

          • shifafa

            I guess we’re just not as courageous and sensible as you, huh?” That’ correct! Finally!

          • Albury Smith

            Since you offered no opinion and didn’t define “we,” I really can’t answer your question.

          • roccolore

            You Democrats are the cowards who rally for copkillers.

          • donaldball

            All methods of protection must be subject to cost-benefit analyses. There are no cost-free interventions, there are no free lunches.

            From where I sit, the only effective response to 9/11 was hardened cockpit doors. Everything else has been a gigantic waste of resources at best and wildly counter-productive at worst.

          • Albury Smith

            Hardened cockpit doors are probably the best way to prevent another 9/11, but keeping threats off airliners is also essential. The cost of 9/11 was in the hundreds of billions, so other measures are also cost-effective.

          • Bev

            zero odds…
            http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2014/09/10/911-13-years-paul-craig-roberts/

            9/11 After 13 years by Paul Craig Roberts
            Watching the twin towers and WTC 7 come down, it was obvious to me that the buildings were not falling down as a result of structural damage. When it became clear that the White House had blocked an independent investigation of the only three steel skyscrapers in world history to collapse as a result of low temperature office fires, it was apparent that there was a coverup.

            After 13 years people at home and abroad find the government’s story less believable. The case made by independent experts is now so compelling that
            mainstream media has opened to it. Here is Richard Gage of Architects & Engineers for 9/11 Truth on C-SPAN:

            (Note: watch video on c-span as over 100,000 people have)
            http://www.c-span.org/video/?320748-5/washington-journal-architects-engineers-911-truth

            Architects and Engineers for 9/11 Truth
            Richard Gage talked about his group, Architects and Engineers for 9/11
            Truth, which claimed that the World Trade Center was brought down by
            explosive demolition on September 11, 2001. The group was founded in
            2006 and said its mission was to “expose the official lies and cover-up
            surrounding the events of September 11, 2001 in a way that inspires the
            people to overcome denial and understand the truth.”
            ……….

            Back to Paul Craig Roberts writings:

            Over these 13 years, physicists, chemists, architects, engineers, and first responders have provided massive evidence that completely disproves the official account of the failure of the three skyscrapers. The response to experts has been for non-experts to call experts “conspiracy theorists.” In other words, the defenders of the government’s story have no scientific or factual basis on which to stand. So they substitute name-calling.
            ……………

            http://existentialistcowboy.blogspot.com/2011/07/road-trip-to-ground-zero-get-on-board.html
            Road Trip to Ground Zero: Get on Board
            
by Len Hart, The Existentialist Cowboy



            Anyone who would solve 911 must place the suspect at the scene of the crime. 
Candidates not having method, motive, and opportunity must be eliminated. That applies to Bushco’s scapegoats–some 14 Arab hijackers who cannot be placed (at) the scene of the crime, specifically NONE of them can be placed on any hijacked flight at any time! Until the BBC tracked down some of the alleged hijackers and interviewed them AFTER they were said to have died on 911, I might have been inclined to believe that they had not even existed. But–in any case–a living hijacker in a post-911 world disproves the Bush theory.
            …………

            http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/1559151.stm
            Sunday, 23 September, 2001, 12:30 GMT 13:30 UK



            Hijack ‘suspects’ alive and well

          • Albury Smith

            If the 9/11 hijackers are alive and well, why don’t you get some recorded interviews with them? You’ll instantly be rich and famous.
            What would economist and crackpot Paul Craig Roberts know about forensic structural engineering? What does alleged architect Richard Gage?

        • DoomsdayJesus

          If you’re going to limit the timeframe to suit your argument you’re not a rational debater. 9/11 is an arbitrary point in the history of deaths by terrorism. How many hijackings and bombings were there in the 60’s, 70’s, and 80’s? The fact is that it is an incredibily legitimate threat, numerous groups with the means to do so are actively pursuing it. The reason that it’s so unlikely today is that after decades of screwing the pooch, we’ve largely learned our lesson and take proper action to mitigate risks. To say that everything that’s lowered the risk is now unnecessary is fantastically stupid. That’s like saying pollution’s down, so it’s safe to pull off your catalytic converters. It’s a non sequitur.

        • oggologgo

          The article doesn’t give any valid calculation of the risk of there being a terrorist on a place. The whole article is just assumptions and simple math erroneously interpreted as statistics.

    • FDNY 9/11 Survivor Witness and Whistleblower: Speaks on WTC 7 May 25, 2014

      As a firefighter on 9/11, he was at Ground Zero and was there when Building 7 came down. In this episode of 9/11 Free Fall, he relives his experience that day, recounting how he believes the buildings in New York were brought down in controlled demolitions.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ePPdUUISQOs&list=UUhwwoeOZ3EJPobW83dgQfAg

  • Daisiemae

    But…but…anything to keep us safe…ANYTHING!

    • Albury Smith

      The conclusion here is obvious to any sentient human being: The evil US needs THOUSANDS more terrorists –especially the peace-loving suicide variety — and a ~99% reduction in law enforcement officers. A Muslim utopia like Northern Iraq is right around the corner.
      Two thumbs up to the author of this insightful article for zeroing in on a huge societal flaw. 🙂

      • shifafa

        STFU, Tool……………

        • Albury Smith

          That was fact-filled…

        • roccolore

          You fascist Democrats are the tools who support copkiller Ismail Brindley.

  • the terrorists look for targets of opportunity just like the cops look at us everyday.

    • shifafa

      BINGO! THAT’s how we know that they ARE terrorists!
      FTP

      • roccolore

        You Democrats are the terrorists who support Nidal Hasan, Dzokhar Tsarnaev, Carlos Bledsoe, Ismail Brindley, Wesley Cook, Joanne Chesimard, and Troy Davis.

  • DoomsdayJesus

    The fact that they’re not counting Ft. Hood makes this article laughable. If you have to massage already low statistics you further prove a point, you have more of an axe to grind than a legitimate point to prove.

  • STANDUP!
  • STANDUP!

    I guess the tens of thousands of engineers are also wrong about their scientific observations of what really happened on 911…https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ddz2mw2vaEg

    • Albury Smith

      Good guess. There aren’t “tens of thousands of [real] engineers” who are 9/11 truther nuts, and Box Boy’s absurd video you posted contains no EXPLOSIVES, EVIDENCE, or EXPERTS.

    • HOW ALTERNATIVE MEDIA INFLUENCED THE YEAR OF AWAKENING by Mikael Thalen December 31st, 2013

      While some see the year’s countless political scandals as a negative example of America’s current state, continued revelations and increased public knowledge of government corruption has undoubtedly made 2013 the year of awakening. Although many of the year’s major news stories can be linked to the alternative media’s expanding influence, several in particular are undoubtedly connected to a surge in the public’s awakening.

      Western Governments Run Al Qaeda ‘OURS’

      http://www.storyleak.com/2013-year-awakening/

      General Wesley Clark: Wars Were Planned – Seven Countries In Five Years

      “This is a memo that describes how we’re going to take out seven countries in five years, starting with Iraq, and then Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan and, finishing off, Iran.” I said, “Is it classified?” He said, “Yes, sir.” I said, “Well, don’t show it to me.” And I saw him a year or so ago, and I said, “You remember that?” He said, “Sir, I didn’t show you that memo! I didn’t show it to you!”

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RC1Mepk_Sw&feature=player_embedded

  • Kawaii Smothers

    This post is riddled with fallacies.

  • john

    Mr. Asbury is what is known as a sock puppet. Just google it. You’ll understand why no amount of evidence will deter such a poster. I’d advise all truth seeking people to ignore him as draining your time sowing confusion are his only true goals.

  • rk

    this article is absurd

  • oggologgo

    The whole article is just assumptions and simple math erroneously interpreted as statistics.

  • cintalauraramarimari

    hopefully this data is accurate so that it can be our reference in obat keputihan alami tradisional crystal x.